Survival[]
!!!!
Smalljon Umber?!
Well, I guess he didn't die in the TV series...and Greatjon had other sons in the novels anyway.--The Dragon Demands (talk) 22:25, August 30, 2015 (UTC)
But Smalljon is lord? Wasn't Greatjon not at the Red Wedding and alive and free? - InGen Nate Kenny (talk) 22:48, August 30, 2015 (UTC)
...Cogman did state via twitter that Greatjon is free and alive.
...well maybe Smalljon is just acting lord. I mean Greatjon if alive is trapped at Riverrun. Bran Stark and Lyanna Mormont were "acting" lord because they were physically present; same with Arnolf Karstark being acting lord.--The Dragon Demands (talk) 22:57, August 30, 2015 (UTC)
I'm really hoping Greatjon will be in Season 6. I'd prefer him not to appear at all though instead of them replacing the actor like they did with Rattleshirt, which was disappointing to say the least! 174.56.146.50 23:39, August 30, 2015 (UTC)
- He could also be MIA or gone outlaw in the aftermath of the Red Wedding.--Gonzalo84 (talk) 23:40, August 30, 2015 (UTC)
Title[]
Could we not simply call the article "Smalljon Umber"? I realize the need to distinguish between characters of the same name, but this seems excessively formal... we have "Bran Stark", not "Brandon Stark (Son of Eddard)", after all. - 
14:49, April 28, 2016 (UTC)
I wanted to title them "Greatjon" and "Smalljon" Umber, respectively. I think I got voted down.--The Dragon Demands (talk) 18:34, April 28, 2016 (UTC)
- It would be better, I think. - 14:05, April 29, 2016 (UTC)
His loyalty[]
Why is he with the Bolton when his father is really loyal to the starks and even announced Robb as King in the North?
Are they playing the Boltons, and what is the gift they give Ramsay? Bree 14:50, May 5, 2016 (UTC)
Son is not like the father, necessarily. Smalljon's casting call said he has "hatred that runs deep". That hatred is most likely against the wildlings. Jon let the wildlings to the Umbers' lands, so of course they will be pissed. And the gif he gives Ramsay is most likely Rickon Stark. ----Gladiatus (talk) 15:02, May 5, 2016 (UTC)
Well it has just been confirmed that Rickon Stark will be returning I guess he is the Umbers gift to Ramsey?!Bree 01:27, May 6, 2016 (UTC)
I think it's just a ruse. In the novels, there are two Umber factions: the one pro-Stannis, led by Crowfood and the one pro-Bolton, led by Whoresbane. I think the show's Smalljon will just pose as a Bolton loyalist only to betray Ramsay at some point. He is characterized as a man that has a "hatred that runs deep" but I think this hatred is more directed towards what happened at the Red Wedding, not because of the wildlings. LordofBraxis (talk) 09:34, May 9, 2016 (UTC)
I don't think it's a ruse. If it were, he'd send a decoy in rather than risking the real Rickon. Ramsay clearly didn't know who Rickon was until presented with the head of Shaggydog. No Stark loyalist would send a helpless Stark captive to a man renowned for torturing and murdering his prisoners.
That and the fact that the promo trailers showed Umber banners flying with the Boltons when they duke it out with the wildlings. Brainwasher5 (talk) 03:13, May 13, 2016 (UTC)
- I imagine his last words being "killed by a fookin goat fucker?!" --CrappyScrap (talk) 12:20, June 20, 2016 (UTC)