Board Thread:General Discussion/@comment-4708902-20160726013945/@comment-25402783-20160907152233

Fenrir51 wrote: BigBadBruin343 wrote: Sansa is just as responsible for those mens deaths as Jon is. If she had taken Littlefinger's offer, then the Northern lords would have seen Jon and Sansa as the winning side, and would have been able to rally more houses to their cause. Instead she outright rejects Littlefinger's offer, and then sends word to him without telling Jon, who would have waited to attack if he knew that there was a chance they'd get an army of over 10,000 MEN!

Bran didn't do a good job of ruling Winterfell (it fell when he ruled it), Luwin and Rodrick did. Bran looked board as sh*t when listening to the complaints of the Northern Lords, and didn't really do anything. And if Bran can't get it up, then he can't have sex, if he can't have sex, then he can't have kids. Last I checked no sex = no kids.

Sure, Bran is a greenseer, and that can be helpful, but the Northern Lords clearly want a person that is brave, and a great warrior, not a cripple.

And are you telling me, that the Northen Lords would rather just rule the North, and not all of Westeros? If Jon had a choice of last names, he'd go with Stark, not Targ. He has the North's best interests at heart. Why just rule half of the country, when they could basically rule the whole thing? It's funny that you would quote entire posts and still IGNORE most of the substantive points made against your position!

Sansa is not responsible for Jon Snow playing into Ramsay's hands. She WARNED him against doing just that. Jon had a council of war with Davos Seaworth and Tormund Giantsbane to work out the strategy for the coming battle. Sansa didn't make Jon ignore his plans. So to blame Sansa for the losses at the Battle of the Bastards, when her input was ignored anyway, is absurd! Yes, Sansa should have come clean about Littlefinger's army. But she bears no responsibility for Jon's rashness DURING that battle! Jon's actions during the battle, charging at the enemy army BY HIMSELF, instead of acting like an actual general like he was supposed to, cost him far more of his men's lives than if he had stuck to the plan.

Bran did an excellent job of administrating Winterfell! He sat in the Great Hall and listened to every one of his petitioners and attended all the other civil concerns of his realm while Robb was leading the North's armies in the Riverlands. And no, Rodrik Cassel and Maester Luwin did not rule! If they did, they would have acted like the Small Council in King's Landing and just let Bran go play. Bran was present at his castle's court because it was his responsibility as Acting Lord of Winterfell. He may have looked bored as shit in that first episode, but he was still doing his job. This is just one respect where he differs from Joffrey, Tommen and Robin Arryn. And when Rodrik Cassel learned of an attack at Torrhen's Square, he took the trouble to alert Bran and receive his orders, not just make decisions himself as if he was Tywin Lannister. Bran told Rodrik to take some 200 men, most of the standing force at Winterfell at that time, to protect his vassals. So you're wrong!

If I have to tell you, again, that NOT EVERY PARAPLEGIC is infertile, then I will! "Last I checked no sex = no kids." Yes, thank you for that redundant point! Not everyone paralysed is infertile due to their condition. It depends on the EXTENT of the nerve damage in the lower body. It may be that his paralysis involves his legs and not his sexual organs and bodily functions. I doubt he would have survived long outside Winterfell if he was mired in his own discharges for days on end!

Being a greenseer isn't just useful. It's VITAL for the North to survive the White Walkers! Jon is just a soldier like thousands of others. Bran's abilities can change the course of what could otherwise be a very one-sided conflict. And how is Bran not brave? He spent a couple of years north of the Wall, surviving extreme cold, Night's Watch deserters and the undead. He's killed people in self-defence while warging. And (once again), the Northern lords chose Jon because of his supposed heritage! They DON'T choose their kings based on their military background! If Rickon was alive, they would have chosen him over Jon.

"Are you telling me, that the Northern Lords would rather just rule the North, and not all of Westeros?"

YES! Because they've said it themselves! They don't see the rest of Westeros as their country. Just the North! Sure, Robb Stark was also acclaimed the King of the Trident (in the books) by the lords of the Riverlands, but they're still not part of the actual North! It's been that way for thousands of years. The North was independent for a far longer time than the union of the Seven Kingdoms, which is only 300 years old. Next to the North's millenia-old sovereignity, the Targaryen rule of the Seven Kingdoms is just a mere interlude in the history of the Northern kingdom.

If Sansa had told Jon that they could have an army of over 10,000-20,000 men, and throw in the other Northen Houses that would have sided with the Starks, no trap Ramsay came up with could stop them. Though, Ramsay's plan was dumb in grand scheme of things (killing half his army when he knows that Lannisters will attack at some point). Sansa is just as resposible for the loss of life, as Jon is. Hell, maybe if she told him she'd be Queen in the North. What she did was stupid, and almost evil. Not even telling her "brother" that she conntacted Littlefinger, knowing Jon has a good chance of dying in battle. Yeah, great job Sansa.

Bran looked bored when running Winterfell. And it was clearly Luwin doing most of the heavy lifting. He was the one that told the Northen Lords how they'll help, Bran did jack sh*t.

And is Bran a leader? Has he led anybody into battle? Rallied troops? No, he hasn't. That's clearly one of the primary reasons that the Northern Lords chose Jon to be king. Clearly the line of succsesion doesn't matter to them. Sansa should be Queen in the North of they cared.

And as you stated, the Northmen don't mind ruling the south, seeing as Robb was king in the Riverlands as well. Would they mind a king that was raised by Ned Stark, and born of Lyanna Stark?

I doubt the Northern Lords will flock to Bran if Jon's parentage gets out."Let's ditch this guy that's fought the White Walkers, led men into battle, and is a natural leader, for this cripple that lost Winterfell, got the last of the Childern of the Forest killed, along with a powerful tree wizard, and Hordor and his wolf." Yeah, great job Bran. Hell he'll be the reason the White Walkers are able to passed the Wall next season (the mark on Bran's arm).